[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 488: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4756: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3891)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4758: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3891)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4759: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3891)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4760: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3891)
Kerkythea Rendering System • View topic - flicker problem
FAQ  •  Register  •  Login

flicker problem

Moderator: ModeratorGroup

<<

kingsteve111

Posts: 8

Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:31 am

Post Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:43 am

flicker problem

flicker.jpg


Hi all :D

I have built some very large models and spent a lot of time setting them up for render in Kerkythea (64 bit-v2.5.2) and I have tried EVERYTHING I can find to resolve the issue I am having.

I am rendering a flythrough and the image flickers:
SEE IMAGE:

Basically, the image flickers/lighting is different from frame to frame.

Here is what I do to start a render:
Select the walkthrough cameras then render the first frame (using MLT) to create the light cache.
Then I lock the caches (photon mapping, diffuse interreflection and density estimation)
Then I run the render again allowing all frames to be rendered.

The result is still the same. What am I doing wrong?

*pulling my hair out*

settings.jpg
<<

notareal

KT-Team
KT-Team

Posts: 4211

Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 7:27 am

Location: Finland

Post Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:04 am

Re: flicker problem

Cache locking is for photon mapping (biased) not for MLT (or other unbiased rendering).
Thea Render and Kerkythea Rendering System, by Solid Iris Technologies
<<

kingsteve111

Posts: 8

Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:31 am

Post Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:32 am

Re: flicker problem

<<

kingsteve111

Posts: 8

Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:31 am

Post Wed Aug 07, 2013 6:19 am

Re: flicker problem

Anyone have any solution? I'm really stuck here.... :(
<<

notareal

KT-Team
KT-Team

Posts: 4211

Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 7:27 am

Location: Finland

Post Wed Aug 07, 2013 8:19 am

Re: flicker problem

Maybe you can build a suitable kst script
viewtopic.php?p=89670#p89670
For outdoor (Sun&Sky or HDR as a only light source) you could use this preset viewtopic.php?p=46756#46756
If you don't want to use script, you first need to load and apply the preset, then render the first frame and after that lock cache. There is no cache to lock for unbiased rendering, it only works with biased.
Thea Render and Kerkythea Rendering System, by Solid Iris Technologies
<<

kingsteve111

Posts: 8

Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:31 am

Post Wed Aug 07, 2013 9:01 am

Re: flicker problem

<<

notareal

KT-Team
KT-Team

Posts: 4211

Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 7:27 am

Location: Finland

Post Wed Aug 07, 2013 9:38 am

Re: flicker problem

If it flickers, I wonder, maybe you actually are not rendering with MLT? MLT would probably have some static noise, but no flickering. Looking your posted image, a frame with MLT would probably take several hours to reach about 120 passes with i7 (but maybe you have some insane four way multiprocessor system?).
Here are some tutorial to adjust biased rendering settings viewtopic.php?t=9803 and some interior animation preset viewtopic.php?p=57372#p57372
Thea Render and Kerkythea Rendering System, by Solid Iris Technologies
<<

kingsteve111

Posts: 8

Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:31 am

Post Sun Aug 18, 2013 1:14 am

Re: flicker problem

I have tried everything I can think of to fix this but still no solve to the problem. I am currently rendering with MLT, 8 threads and five passes, although the issue persisted with 20 passes. As this is a fly through animation, I simply don't have the option to render with more passes as it takes weeks to render each scene with just 5 passes (which really is ample quality for my needs).


Can anyone see the problem in my MLT settings below:

<Root Label="Default Render Settings" Name="" Type="Render Settings">
<Object Identifier="./Ray Tracers/Metropolis Light Transport" Label="Metropolis Light Transport" Name="Metropolis Light Transport" Type="Ray Tracer">
<Parameter Name="Max Ray Tracing Depth" Type="Integer" Value="100"/>
<Parameter Name="Max Iterations" Type="Integer" Value="5"/>
<Parameter Name="Linear Lightflow" Type="Boolean" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="Seed Paths" Type="Integer" Value="50000"/>
<Parameter Name="Large Step Probability" Type="Real" Value="0.2"/>
<Parameter Name="Max Mutation Distance" Type="Real" Value="0.02"/>
<Parameter Name="Live Probability" Type="Real" Value="0.7"/>
<Parameter Name="Max Consecutive Rejections" Type="Integer" Value="200"/>
<Parameter Name="Bidirectional" Type="Boolean" Value="0"/>
<Parameter Name="Image Filename" Type="String" Value="temp_mlt.jpg"/>
<Parameter Name="Random Seed" Type="String" Value="Automatic"/>
</Object>
<Object Identifier="./Environments/Octree Environment" Label="Octree Environment" Name="Octree Environment" Type="Environment">
<Parameter Name="Max Objects per Cell" Type="Integer" Value="20"/>
</Object>
<Object Identifier="./Filters/Simple Tone Mapping" Label="Simple Tone Mapping" Name="" Type="Filter">
<Parameter Name="Enabled" Type="Boolean" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="Method" Type="String" Value="Simple"/>
<Parameter Name="Exposure" Type="Real" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="Gamma Correction" Type="Real" Value="2.2"/>
<Parameter Name="Dark Multiplier" Type="Real" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="Bright Multiplier" Type="Real" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="Reverse Correction" Type="Boolean" Value="1"/>
</Object>
<Object Identifier="./Global Settings/Default Global Settings" Label="Default Global Settings" Name="" Type="Global Settings">
<Parameter Name="Ambient Light" Type="RGB" Value="0 0 0"/>
<Parameter Name="Background Color" Type="RGB" Value="0 0 0"/>
<Parameter Name="Compute Volume Transfer" Type="Boolean" Value="0"/>
<Parameter Name="Transfer Recursion Depth" Type="Integer" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="Background Type" Type="String" Value="Sky Color"/>
<Parameter Name="Sky Intensity" Type="Real" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="Sky Frame" Type="Transform" Value="1 0 0 0
0 1 0 0
0 0 1 0
"/>
<Parameter Name="Sun Direction" Type="String" Value="0 0 1"/>
<Parameter Name="Sky Turbidity" Type="Real" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="./Location/Latitude" Type="Real" Value="0"/>
<Parameter Name="./Location/Longitude" Type="Real" Value="0"/>
<Parameter Name="./Location/Timezone" Type="Integer" Value="0"/>
<Parameter Name="./Location/Date" Type="String" Value="0/0/2006"/>
<Parameter Name="./Location/Time" Type="String" Value="12:0:0"/>
<Parameter Name="./Background Image/Filename" Type="String" Value="[No Bitmap]"/>
<Parameter Name="./Background Image/Projection" Type="String" Value="UV"/>
<Parameter Name="./Background Image/Offset X" Type="Real" Value="0"/>
<Parameter Name="./Background Image/Offset Y" Type="Real" Value="0"/>
<Parameter Name="./Background Image/Scale X" Type="Real" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="./Background Image/Scale Y" Type="Real" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="./Background Image/Rotation" Type="Real" Value="0"/>
<Parameter Name="./Background Image/Smooth" Type="Boolean" Value="1"/>
<Parameter Name="./Background Image/Inverted" Type="Boolean" Value="0"/>
</Object>
<Parameter Name="./Ray Tracers/Active" Type="String" Value="Metropolis Light Transport"/>
<Parameter Name="./Irradiance Estimators/Active" Type="String" Value="Null Irradiance Estimator"/>
<Parameter Name="./Direct Light Estimators/Active" Type="String" Value="Null Direct Light Estimator"/>
<Parameter Name="./Environments/Active" Type="String" Value="Octree Environment"/>
<Parameter Name="./Filters/Active" Type="String" Value="Simple Tone Mapping"/>
</Root>


So grateful for any help anyone can provide
<<

notareal

KT-Team
KT-Team

Posts: 4211

Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 7:27 am

Location: Finland

Post Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:48 am

Re: flicker problem

Settings do look fine. 5 to 20 passes do sound low for MLT. Is it just noise that bother or is it some sort of exposure difference (that is generally understood as flickering). Can you post some full frames, one that looks correct for you and one that causes flickering. Have you looked trough all materials so that they are physically correct, no back faces in model and no modelling issues like overlapping meshes with emitters, lights and so? Btw did you try preset (biased)?
Thea Render and Kerkythea Rendering System, by Solid Iris Technologies
<<

kingsteve111

Posts: 8

Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:31 am

Post Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:36 am

Re: flicker problem

Attachments
Part B - 3 - Mezzanine_0184.jpg
Part B - 3 - Mezzanine_0183.jpg
Part B - 3 - Mezzanine_0212.jpg
<<

notareal

KT-Team
KT-Team

Posts: 4211

Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 7:27 am

Location: Finland

Post Mon Aug 19, 2013 2:10 pm

Re: flicker problem

Certainly there is some issue. Maybe you could first take a look if materials are the problem. You can replace all materials except emitters and glass with some diffuse grey and check if flickering still occurs. Then take a look if lights are fine, no sharing geometry with other models. Tinkering MTL settings may also help:

The two I might consider changing if scene is exceptionally difficult (complex indirect light paths) are
- Seed Paths, used initialising the render, greater the number more paths are available for mutations (up to 100000 - 500000 or even greater).
- Large Step Probability, might go up to 0.5. If a large step is accepted, then Metropolis process starts from a new random
seed, this should help to lighten darker areas.
But if you start to tinker these, values you need carefully look acceptance ratio from console log... if it reduces a lot, render time will be longer.
Thea Render and Kerkythea Rendering System, by Solid Iris Technologies
<<

Fletch

KT-Team
KT-Team

Posts: 8564

Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:38 am

Location: Milwaukee, WI USA

Post Wed Aug 21, 2013 7:08 am

Re: flicker problem

This is a very strange problem, Steve. I've never seen it before. Of course I haven't seen anyone attempt an MLT animation on such a complex model.
I can't help, but wanted to say that the "bright" frame shown above looks like it's exposure settings are different from the other ones. I mention that because it's not the same as a flicker I would get from different light cache or flares/flashes from low PM+FG render settings. It looks more like to me that the exposure settings have been changes for the entire image. I tried comparing the original 5 frames several days back, but they were so small before that I couldn't do much with them. :(

Notareal's advice still stands, however, and please most importantly be sure you have not applied light emitting materials to curved geometry. (such as a light bulb or light sconce glass)


<<

notareal

KT-Team
KT-Team

Posts: 4211

Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 7:27 am

Location: Finland

Post Thu Aug 22, 2013 9:31 am

Re: flicker problem

Indeed, this is not related to biased flickering, that can (usually) be fixed by locking cache. Most likely there is some issue lights or some materials are not physically correct or backface issues... anyhow it's next to impossible to guess without seeing the actual scene.
Thea Render and Kerkythea Rendering System, by Solid Iris Technologies
<<

kingsteve111

Posts: 8

Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:31 am

Post Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:35 am

Re: flicker problem

Thanks guys.

Im going to try/test all of your suggestions. I have purchased thea render last year but I didnt find it as user friendly as Kerkythea. I'd love to be able to import scenes created in kerkythea
<<

Fletch

KT-Team
KT-Team

Posts: 8564

Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:38 am

Location: Milwaukee, WI USA

Post Mon Aug 26, 2013 12:36 pm

Re: flicker problem

Thea opens .xml scenes from KT
I highly suggest updating to latest Thea render just released.


Next

Return to Tips and Tricks

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 1 guest

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by ST Software for PTF.